Ask this, not that
“College Fair Week” is upon us in the Pittsburgh area. I don’t think that’s an official name, but any school counselor or admissions rep that covers Western PA will know what you’re talking about if you mention those three words. Annual fairs in the North and South Hills, as well as a PACAC (state association) fair at Robert Morris, and at least a half-dozen other fairs will be taking place October 5-9. It will be a little bittersweet for me to not attend (representing a university, anyways), so I thought I’d share some reflections on questions students and parents can and should pose of the esteemed representatives visiting “tahn.”
I know it can feel a bit vulnerable to ask questions, especially when you don’t know what to ask (or you just want that really cool pen or sticker), but trust me when I say that it can be just as nerve-racking for the admissions person across the table! Be yourself, and remember you probably aren’t going to make or break your chances with that college in that moment. What can happen, however, is learning a great piece of information, or starting a kinship with a person that wants to see you at their university.
Rather than: “How is your ___ major?”
Ask instead: “What is your favorite thing about your ___ major?” or “What does life at (college) look like for a person interested in (broader field)?”
It’s a valid question. You want to know that if you’re studying Scare Theory at Monsters University, that it’s a good place to do so. However, it’s a question that’s both easy and hard to answer. More than likely, the rep isn’t going to put down the major, but really there are only two possible answers to this question. Make it open-ended, so you can decide “how” the major is for YOU.
Rather than: “What is your average GPA/SAT/ACT score?”
Ask instead: “What does ___ look for in a competitive application?”
With a few exceptions, most schools are not going to look at just that one metric you’re asking about. If you have a GPA or test score that falls below their answer, it can be jarring. But it is not an on-the-spot admit or deny. Instead, take this opportunity to learn more about the bigger picture. They may or may not mention those “averages.” But they will likely tell you some of the other things they look for that can help you stand out.
Rather than: “Do you have ___ (club/organization)?”
Ask instead: “Can you tell me about some of the unique clubs/organizations on campus, or ways students get involved?”
Again, all of these “rather than” questions are completely valid. Some pundits will scoff at the questions about major or club/activity, and say “you could just look these up,” but colleges can blend together, and we’re human. We forget. That is partially why I want you to rephrase the question above. The schools I’ve worked at had 300-750+ clubs and organizations, and sometimes they come and go. It’s nearly impossible for the rep to know all of them (same goes for majors, honestly). Ideally here, the college shares an interesting tidbit or two, and then volleys back to you, asking about your interests, and a conversation flows.
Rather than: “What is your tuition?”
Ask instead: “What opportunities does ___ offer to make college more affordable?”
Similar to the GPA question above, and perhaps more so, the answer may shock you. Sticker shock, even. Appropriate, because you will likely be told the sticker price. In reality, the sticker price may not be what you pay. Let the college tell you about the opportunities that might exist to get that number lower. Saying the quiet part out loud, that college is pricey, does not reflect negatively on you. The person behind the table knows that, and may have student loans of their own!
Bonus questions I like:
“Tell me about a recent student who’s done something that made you go ‘wow’.”
The best admissions professionals know the power of stories. Let them tell of the college student who founded a startup or is working for the public good. You could be their next story.
“What are some of the places your students (intern, study abroad)?”
You never know when a college is going to have a connection to the company where you’ve dreamed of working. Also, keep an open mind about study abroad. At many schools, you can do so for the same price of attending “on campus.” Some places, it may even be cheaper!
“Tell me about the best college essay you’ve ever read.”
Obviously, you should not copy their response, but this will give a peek behind the curtain, and reinforce how truly infinite the list of essay topics is. And, I imagine if you asked 100 reps, you would get 100+ different answers. They (it feels weird not writing “we”) like to share their opinion, and chances are, some will give you two for the price of one!
Regardless of whether you’re nearby next week’s fairs, I hope you’ll take the opportunity to have rich conversations with college representatives. The field is filled with wonderful people who want to help. That spirit still lives in me, and I hope I gave you a talking point or ten!
Happy October,
--
Adam
Selective sabotage
Last week, I attended a webinar with NACAC (the National Association for College Admission Counseling), an organization of which I am a member. The broader topic of the webinar was trends in college admission, and I left with a lot of helpful takeaways. The one that has sat with me the most, however, was a statistic: there are 33 colleges that accept less than 10% of their applicants. The next range, 11-20% acceptance, contains 36 schools. For those keeping score at home, that’s roughly 70 schools, and when you consider that there are roughly 2,800 colleges or universities in the US, we’re talking only 2.5% in the most selective deciles. As you can imagine, applications to these schools are surging.
I bet if quizzed, you could probably name a healthy number of these ~70 schools. They’re going to be a lot of the “usual suspects,” the schools that dominate the rankings, year in and year out. They’re the schools that the media (whether social or traditional) places on a pedestal. No question, these schools are graduating students who achieve great outcomes, but they are far from the only ones who can claim successful graduates. For instance, Penn State is #2 in the nation for most CEO’s produced, according to a LinkedIn study. Penn State is not one of the 69 schools that accept 20% of applicants or less.
I foresee the perils of rankings and cautionary tales regarding selectivity as being recurring themes for future entries. We’ll get into that in the coming weeks and months, but I’ll share my favorite anectode of this, as illustrated by Malcolm Gladwell in his best-seller, David and Goliath. In summary, a strong student with a proclivity toward the sciences narrows down their college choice to an Ivy League school, and a public research institution with a solid (albeit not Ivy League) reputation. The student, who probably didn’t expect to get in, is smitten by prestige and chooses the Ivy League “Goliath.” They attend, struggle, and switch majors, away from the sciences altogether, settling into a career that doesn’t stimulate or interest them. Years later, comparing the resources (availability of professors, collaboration versus competition) and the experiences of others at the “David” school, they realize that they would still be in the sciences had they chosen their very viable other top option.
To be clear, a student should not exclude these intensely competitive schools from their list. Nor should they assume that they’re in for the same experience as the student in Gladwell’s book. My points are this:
Attending a school that is less-selective does not mean “settling.”
A student’s college list should be balanced, and not skewed heavily toward that super selective seventy or so.
There are many options that do not necessarily show up in rankings or media that might be the one for you/your student.
Working with an IEC is a great way to learn more about these schools, make sure your list is balanced, and feel great about making a choice that checks the right boxes. Let’s start the conversation!
--
AK
What’s this all about?
I attended my first college fair last week.
OK, so this was only the first college fair I’ve ever attended without a university’s logo on my chest, and the only one that I didn’t find myself behind the table representing that university. The fair was held by the Pittsburgh Diocese’s Catholic high schools, and several of those school’s counselors are dear friends. Even though I’d recently elected free agency with River’s Edge nearing its debut, I wanted to help out those friends, and see several of my admissions friends whom I already miss. I emceed a panel where reps from six colleges dished on the college admissions process to parents and students.
As I drove home from the South Hills, with The Menzingers’ “Everything I Ever Saw” playing on my Spotify, it got me reflecting on my own journey. I was not technically a first-generation student, but shared some similarities. Forgoing college, my dad entered the workforce directly from high school and my mom was what the current nomenclature would call a “post-traditional student.” She attended college part-time in the evenings, and I actually got to see her walk at graduation. This was a deeply impactful experience that I feel set me on the path that led me to working in higher education. I remember poking around the buildings on her campus, seeing the research posters on the walls, the coming-together of students and the validation that being an eager learner wasn’t “uncool,” like it sometimes felt in the schools or hockey locker rooms of my youth.
We didn’t have the financial resources or first-hand experiences of many of my peers, but my parents couldn’t have been more awesome or supportive of my and my sister’s journey to college. They attended financial aid workshops, drove us to every corner of the state to see campuses, and read every bit of literature they could find. My mom just said the other day that I knew where I was attending in middle school. And my sister, the moment she stepped foot in North Philly she knew she was going to be a Temple Owl. But we never had a college fair within a reasonable driving distance from our community, and I often wonder “what if” I had broadened my search a little bit? I only officially visited three campuses - a large urban public, a mid-size rural public, and a small, suburban private (all in PA). Maybe I would have ended up at the same place, maybe not. (Thankfully, my county has since added an annual college fair.)
My point with this is that, knowing what I now do about college admissions, I am a big proponent of students taking advantage of the immense time, effort, and resources colleges put into being accessible to them. If your school or community has a college fair, bring an open mind and use that time to learn about schools in places you’ve never been or heard of. Same goes for when colleges visit your high school, if that is available. Even if you have just a mild interest in the school, it can attune you to the things that are important to you, what questions you should be asking and answering, and so on. Finally, one of the biggest yet simplest resources is colleges’ admission websites. More often than not, these have a page where you can locate your region’s admissions contact. When I started in admissions, this was not yet commonplace, but has become the standard, and is a great way to make a connection. As I said in my last entry, if the person who is responsible for your state/region/high school does not at least know your name, you are doing yourself a disservice. I just heard an admissions officer say on a podcast, that the applications at his school are read by that region’s counselor, and that they look for reasons TO admit a student (as opposed to not admitting them). The podcast is the College Admissions Process podcast by Dr. John Durante, and I highly recommend it!
The title of this entry happens to be my all-time favorite question ever asked by a student, who stopped by my table at a college fair. I could tell he was a little exasperated, probably not sure where to start, and had never heard of my university. But it was just so genuine, and I so appreciated the courage it took to ask and start the conversation. If such an opportunity arises for you, I hope you will, in your way, summon that courage. In the coming weeks and months, I look forward to showing and telling you what River’s Edge is all about.
‘Til then,
--
AK
4 Things Admission Counselors Wish You Knew
After spending the past 11 Fall seasons in a handful of roles that all essentially boiled down to being an admission counselor, I have to admit, it feels strange to view them in anything other than the present tense. But in a way, this feels cathartic because I can speak from the heart, having spent nearly a third of my life bridging the gap between prospective student and institution. In my role as an IEC, I still do that, but “institution” becomes plural. Here are some of the commonalities I have observed that are not unique to one institution, ones which I feel are fair to say ring true for the majority of colleges.
That text message may have been automated, the next one might not be.
Last summer, I had a very unpleasant interaction where a student responded to one of our text messages with some extremely insensitive language. Though the first message originated from our marketing department, my response to the student expressing disappointment did not, nor did the word that got back to their school counselor. Hopefully this goes without saying, but if you wouldn't want your grandmother to read it, it's best kept to yourself.
Relationships matter.
Despite every effort, I would estimate that 95% of the students in my territory (all of whom I personally reached out to multiple times), did not elevate the conversation beyond "one-way." Anytime I ever had an opportunity to advocate for a student, for more scholarship dollars, a spot off the wait-list, etc., the easiest students to do that for were the ones I had interacted (pleasantly) with. If your admissions rep doesn't recognize your name, it's a missed opportunity.
Choose your email carefully.
Beyond the inappropriate email handles every admissions rep has a story about coming across, a common mistake students often make is using their school email address. Often, once they graduate, they no longer have access to this email. It could cause your college of choice to have trouble reaching you. A great practice is to create an email for the specific purpose of applying to colleges. Something containing your name, the word "college," and your graduation year is a great way to compartmentalize.
We read a lot of essays.
In a given year, I think it's safe to say admission staff each read more essays than there were people at Taylor and Travis's wedding. Extrapolate that over multiple years, and my "essays read" is probably enough to sell out Madison Square Garden. We know this puts a lot of pressure on the student, but the reason I share this is applicants often fall short in differentiating themselves. I've read more essays about a torn ACL cutting soccer season short than you can believe (it is devastating, I know! I do not mean to minimize that). But I have only read one where the student walked me through their favorite pasta recipe and how the three simple ingredients represented their identity. Every student has something so uniquely "them," it just needs some coaxing. Stick around long enough and there will be plenty more essay tips, believe me!
Thank you for reading my first blog post. I hope you were able to find an action item, or maybe some reassurance. You got this!
--
AK